where the 11th hour stephanie ruhle starts now. tonight, the legal battle over mike pence's testimony, one of trump's lawyers who could've been before the grand jury tomorrow, in court today, challenging subpoenas for the former vice president. and, ron desantis walking back his comments on ukraine, we'll struggling to answer softball questions from a friendly interviewer. then, the clock ticking on tiktok, the company ceo grilled on capitol hill for hours, over security concerns. what it means for the absentee 50 million american users, as the 11th hour gets underway on this thursday night. >> good evening, i'm mehdi hassan in for stephanie ruhle. former president trump's legal panel is about to get more worse. one of his attorneys, evan corcoran, is about to do appear before an attorney is backing the classified documents, case as early as tomorrow. but corcoran is also involved in the other federal investigation involving trump. today, he appeared in federal

court in d. c., as part of the team -- but subpoenaed to former vice president mike pence, these hearings focused on whether pence must testify about his dealings with trump, around january the 6th, the lawyers for trump appeared to be at odds with the former vice, nbc news puts, it they argue pence can't testify, because of executive privilege. pence argues he's immune from testifying for legal protection for lawmakers, he says he is acting for president of the senate as part of the electoral vote count, as opposed to part of the executive branch. come on, guys get your excuse straight. , meanwhile in new york, no word from the grand jury in the stormy daniels hush money case. the jury is expected to meet again on monday, but we did hear from alvin bragg's office in the form of a letter to house republicans flatly requesting rejecting any requests for information with hush money case. one house democrat had this reaction for the republican demand. >> i was astonished actually when i saw the letter from the three committee chairs. to mr. bryan. essentially calling on him to violate grand jury secrecy laws in new york of course is a felony. he rightly declined to do that.

>> amid all this former president is lashing up with a violent attacks and alvin bragg calling him among other things a quote, soros backed animal. with that, let's bring in our lead off panel, j. d. bennett, pulitzer prize-winning justice department 40 for the new york times, former new york prosecutor, charles coleman, and former federal prosecutor ornato marriott, he's also legal affairs columnist for political management. let's start with you. here's what the new york times says about evan cork and suspected testimony in the classified documents case. quote, according to two people familiar with the, event he's not intending to invoke his fifth amendment right against self incrimination, and he testifies, underscoring he's not the target of a special counsel scrutiny. if that is the case, renata, what does it mean for donald j trump. >> huge problem for trump.

there are reasons why people are frank and forthcoming with their attorneys, it's because they have an expectation of attorney-client privilege, and that's really what makes this so dangerous, many, because frankly, the crime fraud exception is often discussed, sometimes on television, and many times elsewhere, but it is fairly very rarely invoked. we are practicing criminal law for only 40 years never seen a prosecutor invoke attorney client privilege. invoke the crime fraud exception. here it was actually upheld by a judge, and a court of appeals, and really what i see is corcoran actually being cooperative for the prosecutors here. it doesn't seem to me like he's fighting this, he is more concerned about his own liability, his own downside here. >> it is probably what every trump lawyer should be

concerned about. katie, corcoran isn't just testifying, he's also been asked for no transcripts, what could those reveal? >> the notes in transcription show, both what actually happened, it could show inconsistencies, and most importantly, we can actually show state of mind it's one of the things prosecutors have had a hard time establishing with, trump variety of cases and matters, what was you thinking, what did the intend. these are documents that actually could help jack smith get to that. now, a prosecutor does not need state of, nine per se, in order to win a case or bring a case, but it's extremely helpful, it's really convincing evidence to show a jury, why this is necessary, to prosecute this crime, is that sort of evidence can show people what trump is thinking, and what he intended to do. >> charles, out of all the trump cases that we talk about, how big a threat is the facing from this classified documents

investigation? >> well many, i think this is one of the more serious cases that you see dealing with, because from quite frankly is one of the more straightforward cases that you're dealing with. i think there's no question about the fact that he had the uents, there's no question but the fact that he's been told that he should not have the documents, and now it's what we've seen from jack smith, in his office, and with the continued crowd is showing us. basically, there's very little questions, they're eliminating any question as to whether he intended to defraud the

government, or at least to give the government the wrong idea, but how those documents remained in his possession. it's in the more and more we see from jack smith in, court the more and more becomes clear that he's trying to basically wrap this thing up, and make it beyond a reasonable doubt, so that he's able to move forth with the indictment, in a prosecution. because it's like what i, said from all the cases that he's, facing -- and the fact that we're talking about a federal offense here. >> and we're not, oh jack smith wants to get pence under oath of the january 6th case. so as a recognize that he might have testified, pence might have to testify, that there are these kinds conflicting arguments about communities in the branches. we'll eventually see mike pence under oath testifying? >> i think you're likely to see, that i think this is obviously novel question, we've never had a vice president, who claims that he's part of the legislative branch of the time, it's very unusual, it's not a laugh, or like some of the trump arguments that have been said, but certainly very

unusual, i don't think it's ultimately going to prevail, and this is just yet another aggressive move by jack smith, invoking crime fraud exception one, case and this case going after money from the vice president, and fighting that in court in a way that robert mueller, was never willing to do to get donald trump to testify. >> very good point, katie, do we have a sense of where council direction it might be on the january 6th case. for a lot of watching, as some of the official case, because, to the insurrection, documents, hush money case, now appealing comparison to january 6th. >> right, and one of the cases it feels very important to people, was the undermining democracy, was in doing the american projects. and that's what people really want to see prosecutors in the criminal justice system address. now that said, it's not clear that they're close to doing anything directly about donald trump, from our reporting, seems like prosecutors are

looking at evidence as many people in his orbit, but at the same time, whether or not those people actually flip on trump and give evidence, help prosecutors shore up the really airtight solar case that want to bring before the jury, is up in the air. like trump, said the documents case is much more straightforward, seems like it's moving very quickly. and it's a case that could be bought sooner, it's not nothing happened on january 6th. but again, when you see cases that are sensitive, we want as much evidence as possible, it's not unusual to see prosecutors a charge and indict people, who are below the person they want to originally indict, to see if they can float them and get more evidence. >> trials, talking of cases that aren't that straightforward, we've been

waiting for the manhattan grand jury in the hush money case, l. a., tonight stormy daniels's lawyer was asked of should be a witss there is an indictment, how will it listen. > yes, she's made that very clear. she would be willing to testify, and she would support her testimony of documents and evidence, and acquire robbery shun with witnesses. >> charles, do you think the da is weighing whether to bring her before the grand jury, would you, if you're in alvin bragg situation. >> that's a great question, many, i think the answer to that is a little more complicated than we think, the reason i say that is it really depends on the legal theory that alvin bragg is trying to move forward on, you know he says a misdemeanor, when you're talking about falsifying business records, that's very clear, we have that and we know you can get a conviction with donald trump, based on the evidence acropolis the store we

heard from michael cohen and others. the issue is, can we get that misdemeanor to a felony? and getting it to the felony requires a number of different legal maneuvers, that are basically untested before the law and before the kids. stormy daniels might be a part of a process, michael cohen would be part of that process, terms of the timing, establishing what was said to whom, and by whom. and so if i'm gonna proceed in that regard, to try to get that misdemeanor to a felony, i'm strongly considering stormy daniels testimony, because i cannot take the chance of leaving any stone unturned, in the prosecution of a former president. >> very good point, we're not out the man and gates office blasted republicans for their letter this week, saying the letter only came after donald trump created a false expectation, that would be arrested next day, and his lawyer reportedly argued

intervene, neither is a legitimate basis for congressional inquiry. it's a reaction to how the hous gop is questioning brag, and brags response. >> well, we went after the federalism. so have different layers of government in the united states, state and local prosecutors, ultimately, can make their own decisions, and so the idea that they were going to have a federal inquiry, to determine whether federal resources are being used and local rosecution, it seems totally bogus, and in fact, i think the manhattan da was right to point out, it was ultimately a sham excuse, because there was no actual arrest of his forthcoming. >> so, katie, what has been the

thing in the justice department, as we see these trump cases going forward, and such a polarized environment. we know america garland is thinking. >> i think merrick garland was hoping to see projects mid-comes up with. this is a justice department that plays extremely by the rules, it's now to jack smith to gather compelling evidence. make a strong, case and then to bring back to the deputy attorney, we not to make garland, and argue before, them why these charges are compelling, and this is why we think we can win in a court of law. and garland's made clear from the first he's gonna depend on the judgment, but the career prosecutors below, him and the people at the point, it's not gonna try to undercut, that he really trusts. them so it really does depend on what check smith can do, or what he can bring. what he can show.

charles one last question to you, comes up attacks on alvin bragg or trafficking in some pretty ugly and vile approach -- calling him an animal, human scum, posting a picture of himself to date with a baseball bat next to alvin bragg. what is your reaction to what trump is doing and the deafening silence from the gop? >> well, john trump has shown himself to be a not-so-quiet right nationalist and if you think about what he has said about alvin bragg and the way that he is or to act bonnie will is down in fulton county that is rooted in the notion of white nationalism. it should not be possible for alvin bragg, a black man in the position of district attorney to be able to prosecute. he should not be in charge of these systems. , he should not have access to this power structure to make these unprecedented moves. likewise it, should not be possible that bonnie will, us black woman in fulton county

georgia -- i'm about both of them because they should not have access to our political systems, to our civic processes in such a way that i should have to answer to them. and the other part of what we are seeing from trump's textbook. he cannot control the narrative within the court of law because that is alvin bragg and fani will misses domain, so he has to try to control the narrative in the court of public opinion, which is why he's attacking them, he's attacking michael cohen, and he is going to continue to levy attacks as much as you can to try to control that narrative because you cannot do anything about what is going on in court. >> i just heard the manhattan da's office has good security because he is clearly, from where i'm sitting, inciting violence against them, which is disgusting. katie bennett, -- thank you all for your time, we appreciate it. breaking news out of the middle east tonight, the u.s. and conducting new air strikes in syria, the pentagon says that an american contractor was killed and six other americans, including service members, or hurt in a drone strike in syria. the u.s. intelligence

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accountable for organs, bombing of majority hospitals and genocidal activity in the parts of ukraine. wiping out whole cities, would you support that? >> i think he is a war criminal, this icc we have not done that in the united states because we're concerned about our soldiers and people being brought under, and so i do not know about that rubric. but i do think that he should be held accountable. >> florida governor ron desantis walked back his controversial comments on ukraine as part of an hour-long interview with british broadcaster piers morgan. he had previously downplayed

russia's war in ukraine, and a nearly territorial dispute. we should point out that he clarified stance that putin's war criminal, but american troops should not to deploy to ukraine is not exactly that different to the position that biden staked out last year. >> you may remember i got criticized for calling putin a war criminal. well the truth of the matter is that -- he is a war criminal. >> we said that we do not send u.s. troops to fight russian troops in ukraine, but we would provide robust military assistance and try to unify the western world against russia's aggression. >> so desantis, following joe biden's leadership perhaps. back with us tonight is juanita oliver, msnbc political analyst

and cricket media what day podcast. and stuart stevens, the gop met veteran of the romney bush presidential campaign, he's now with the lincoln project. thank you both for coming on the show tonight, juanita let me start with you. after all of the uterine's back and, fourth desantis on ukraine landed on a very similar position to president biden despite all of the hype around desantis on the right. is it may be just bad at politics? >> i mean, this is a prime example of that, but one thing that desantis to do is that, even though piers morgan did try to give him an out and say, you should not have used the phrase territorial dispute, desantis did not give up any ground. it is literally taking a page from trump's playbook on this to emphasize that i will never apologize, i will never say i was wrong, i will just say that i was misinterpreted. i think tha is something that we can expect a lot more from him, even though like any type of u-turn like this, even before you announce your canidacy for president, shows that you are already operating on your bad foot here.

>> stuart, cassandra's try to slim this as a clarification but it seems like walked back to me. you expect a flip-flop like this to impact him in the gop polls for president? because he's not doing so well in the polls right now, i should point out. >> yeah, generally when you do an artificial analysis for president eludes authorities your support, it's not considered a terrific launch. what is interesting about this is that what he put out on a statement was a written statement and it really is the only written statement of a foreign policy that i'm aware of that this campaign has put out, and they could not get it right. it was clear, he said two things. he said it was not in the u. s. national interest and that it was a territorial dispute. and when he tried to walk it back, he was saying, well what i meant was that now that it is not an existential crisis to ukraine. well he never mentioned that in his original statement. look, there is a reality here and that is that he is going to have to beat donald trump and i do not see anything that he is shown that will show him capable of beating donald trump. >> yeah, me neither.

we should point out that -- tucker carlson, i don't think that they put that much thought into it anyways. juanita all dissent was also asked about the washington post reporting at his time in the navy in guantánamo bay, -- that he used force feeding against prisoners participating in hunger strikes. >> i was a junior officer, i didn't have authority to authorize i think. there may have been a commander that would have done it feeding if somebody was going to die, but that was not something that i would've have authority to do. >> juanita do you think that this part of the census record is going to get more attention in the future? there are so much more that could come out about him in the future, his time in the navy, his time in congress,'s time as a teacher. so far he's been cocoon in his safe right wing space of florida for so long. >> absolutely, it is got to get more play especially when people start running back that 28 clip or he directly says to an interview or, yes, i was giving legal advice and yeah, i advised force feeding people in guantánamo bay. the thing is though, in 2018, he was trying to flex.

he was trying to flex to the point that he was running his mouth a little too much and now the receipts are there and that video clip is going to start making the rounds, but politically speaking, i do not think it is going to get any type of traction with republican primary voters because, if anything, they were down for the cause. all the human rights abuses and torture that did happen at

guantánamo bay for years and years. so, if anything, sadly this will likely score him point with that audience. >> yeah, juanita, i do agree with you. if he came out tomorrow and said hey i force fed them, i torture them, i water border them, he will go up in the gop polls sadly. it's just the nature of the gop base right now. stuart, another strange moment in that interview, 9/11 related, to have a watch. >> where were you on 9/11? >> you know, i had just graduated to college and was not a care in the world and then all of a sudden boom, it just happened. and so i already had been accepted or planning to go to law school, and that is when i decided to start looking into other career choices. >> stuart, how is it possible that the man who wanted to be the next republican president

of the united states cannot remember where he was on 9/11? >> i guess it's better than donald trump who made up a story that he was at 9/11, but this is a very weird interview. even the fact that, why is he doing an interview with piers morgan, a guy who is most noted for gun control in the republican primary. you know, all of this wreaks of not being able -- ready for primetime. -- rick perry in 2012, a big state governor, a lot of hoopla, a lot of people -- you read the national review and they're just trying desperately to invent something that is not there. and then you get out there and what do you got? the leap from running to governor to running to president is so vast, it is really unimaginable by most staff and most candidates. i think that is what you're seeing here. now he could have -- but i do not see any indication that he would. >> yeah, i've always seen desantis as a kind of love child of jeb bush and scott walker, but i guess rick perry is a good example. i don't know if we lost you

there to a technical glitch, but he gave us some wisdom before we lost him. we have him back. juanita, what do you make of ron desantis's chances for president? do you see this man, who is already been dubbed meatball ron, ron sanctimonious, there is no bottom for trump. there is nothing that he will avoid in the scorched earth campaign. what chances have against donald trump? >> look, i still think he has a pretty good chance against trump because of the big possibility of trump still facing multiple indictments from the federal and state levels. when i say, that i'm thinking of the fact that there is still republicans who are primary voters who have long been looking for an all fringe and an alternative to trump. so if desantis can just get himself dressed and show up and not say stupid things every day, . waiting for an ad trump indictment could be a strategic play for his campaign. >> yes indeed. juanita, stuart stevens, thank you both we appreciate it. coming up, republicans predicted armageddon and held dozens of votes to repeal the affordable care act. 13 years later the landmark legislation is still standing. that doesn't mean gop white efforts to weaken it are over. when the 11th hour. continues ty insurance company that's been saving people money for nearly 60 years. for a great low rate, and nearly 60 years of quality coverage-

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then president obama signed the affordable care act into law. in case you forgot, here's a reminder from then vice president joe biden. >> barack obama. [applause] >> ah, joe, joe, joe.

you might also remember that during donald trump's presidency, trump said he would repeal and replace what had become known as obamacare, the aca. he went on fox news, or fox, as i prefer to call it, and he said he would reveal his full and complete health care plan in two weeks. that was 139 weeks ago. we're still waiting on a plan, as trump runs for the white house for a third time. here's what president biden said earlier about republicans as he marked today's anniversary. >> even now, maga republican congressmen are intent on repealing the affordable care act when it is clear it would have a devastating impact on the american people. we still haven't seen the house republican budget.

they want to negotiate. i say, i laid down my budget, you lay down yours, let's negotiate. i don't know where their budget is. >> with us for more, david plouffe, former obama campaign manager and senior adviser to the president. david, thanks for coming back on the show. where would we be right now if not for the aca? and where do you think republicans are hoping to take this country when it comes to health care? 11 years ago you said republicans were calling it obamacare? >> well, yeah, let's remember, there's a lesson here, which is, democrats had 16 votes in the senate, hard to believe that was the case, and i was in washington. there were a lot of democrats who basically wanted to give up on health care. pass a very very reduce bill. remember, mehdi, the economy was still in terrible shape. we were covering from the financial crisis. the politics of this were not great at the moment. but we had tried 400 years to pass this kind of legislation, and this isn't just about winning and maintaining power. we need to do something with that power. help as many people as you can for as long as you have the power. so the politics didn't look good. it heard us in 2010. by 2012 obama's reelection, the affordable ce act was a

positive. i think it has remained that way, because republicans remain obsessed. wdon't yet know what the economy is going to look like a year or 18 months for now as people are casting votes in a presidential election. but there's a lot of uncertainty around the economy. voters concerned about health care really increased. but at times of economic uncertainty particularly. health care security becomes important. you have one party who still seems like the most animating mission other than destroying democracy is removing health care from people and families. that's an argument democrats have always been able to. when i think the but they will be able to win it again in 24. >> so we know republicans are bad on health care. we know obamacare was a historic move, as you pointed out the first time in 100 years that that happened.

but it didn't go far enough. left tens of millions of americans underinsured or uninsured. in 2018, former president obama himself called medicare for all a good idea for democrats. do you think that's the direction that party needs to go as an aspiration? universal health care? >> yeah, and listen, i think back in affordable care act to 2010, he passed everything he could, anti nancy pelosi passed everything she could, and they got all they could with the votes they got. so yeah, they're still -- on vote expansion of -- 9imúo@frvh

work to be done. but fortunately right now, republicans are caught in a time machine. they don't want to talk about how to improve on health care systems. they basically want to attack it, and basically, you know, probably take coverage away from millions if not tens of millions of families. and not hold the special interests accountable. so washington is in gridlock in that regard. they've continued to pass medicaid expansion, but there's a bunch that haven't. and so right now the politics of this or so broad that i don't think you're going to see that. but that shouldn't keep democrats from joe biden on the campaign trail saying exactly what they like to do to cover more people and do it in a more -- way. >> that's the key point. the fact is that there's gridlock should not stop democrats from describing their aspirations. you mentioned obama and pelosi doing what they could with the votes they had. it was a polarized time. a very polarized party. but you compare that to now, politico has a new story out on the former democrat now independent senator kyrsten sinema reporting that in meetings with gop donors, sinema colourfully trash talk

to top democrats, really does insult, some members of the white house, chuck schumer, et cetera. cinemas behavior makes the joe lieberman's and -- look like fdr and lbj. how does joe biden deal with the senate he has to deal with? >> well, listen, the great thing about joe biden, and i saw this up close when he was vice president, if he will find a way to work with anybody, even if they disagree with him on a whole bunch of issues. even if they have taken shots at his metabolism as such he doesn't let that bother him. so that's going to be a fast -- in arizona. no question about that. there's always a question of cinemas, i don't know if this was a week that she was unhappy about her if she's pleased by it. i'm afraid it might be the latter, unfortunately. but as it relates to biden, whether it's joe manchin, whether it's sinema, other folks that i think in the party who haven't always been with

him and he understands that. but he's got to basically seize every opportunity, and try to move the country forward with him. this is a guy that doesn't hold grudges, which is apparently unique in washington. >> yeah, if there's anyone to hold a grudge it would be kirsten sinema who marked who mocked senate democrats as old folks who eat jell-o, is of the republican party is? i'm not sure about that. david plouffe, thank you for your analysis. we appreciate it. coming up, tiktok ceo testifies to a skeptical congress as lawmakers worry about national security and even make an outright ban on the popular app. when the 11th hour continues. ♪♪

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infections that can cause shingles have occurred. don't stop steroids unless told by your doctor. tell your doctor if you have a parasitic infection. may cause headache, injection site reactions, back pain, and fatigue. ask your asthma specialist about a nunormal with nucala. it was a tense day on capitol hill as tiktok ceo shou chew made his first appearance before congress about the safety of the app. for roughly five hours members of the house energy and commerce committee grilled him over privacy concerns, data policies, and child protections. but his answer stood littlest way lawmakers cross the political spectrums. and the seas -- has more. >> we will protect the -- >> tiktok's top executive under fire for more than five hours today. >> tiktok poses as a mr. rogers neighborhood. but it acts like big brother.

>> this usually popular up known for short videos like this, in the spotlight today for this. >> what is your relationship with the communist party? >> ceo shou chew answering questions about whether the app, owned by bytedance a chinese company, is national security threat given the chinese law that could allow the chinese government to access user data. >> i've seen no evidence that the chinese government has access data. they've never asked us, we've not provided. >> i find that actually preposterous. >> i have seen no evidence of this happening. >> tiktok has 150 million users in the u.s. and a billion worldwide, many of them teenagers. the white house has given a company and ultimatum. so the company or face a ban in the u.s. as the justice department and fbi investigate whether bytedance illegally surveilled journalists. >> has biden smiled on american citizens? >> i do not think that spying is the right way to describe it. >> another concern from both

sides the aisle, this information. >> the dangers of misinformation that you mentioned is not allowed on our platform. >> i am sorry to report that it is on your platform. >> congressman, i do not think i can sit here and say that we are perfect and doing this, we do work very hard. >> chew says tiktok's top priorities are protecting your safety, especially for teenagers. securing u.s. data, and being a place for free expression. despite the company's reassurances, 43 states have already banned, restrict, or are considering to ban tiktok on government devices. >> so much of our community is on tiktok, that is what i have devoted my life to working and creating for. >> -- joseph makes a living in creating a tiktok videos for 4. 5 million followers. >> do you think that the

lawmakers were asking the questions today understand tiktok? >> i think that there are some people who definitely have never used the app, have not even seen it working, and you can tell because one lawmaker even called it tic tac. >> in the no or not, lawmakers believe that the data concern israel. >> i want to say the stalled 18 years out there who think that were old and out of touch and do not think that we know what we're talking about, trying to take away your favorite app. you may not care that your data is being accessed now, but it will be one day when you care about it. >> with us for more, nbc news tech correspondent jacob ward. jake, the one thing that i want to know, if i'm sitting at home and my kid is on tiktok, should have be worried about their safety, their privacy, them being surveilled by the chinese government? what do we know? >> well, we know in least as much as what mr. chew was

saying in congress today, that this map is no different than the one that we subject our teen years do every day, one that is made by american companies. the limits that it has put on itself like surveilling gps data, biometric data, and if anything he described a more restraint map than many of the upper reserves that we routinely allow teenagers to use on a daily basis. and so, it is interesting is that while on the one hand, you know, you see this tremendous outpouring of outrage about this particular app, what struck me is that somebody who's been watching these apps for a long time, and the company behind, them the practices and policies of this app, of tiktok, is really not that different than all of the others. it is just that the ownership structure and its national origin is so different. >> so, as you say lawmakers have made a huge fuss about data privacy, that outrage seems exclusive to tiktok as you point out. american maker ops facebook, twitter, it's ultra, all employ

the same tactics. is it simply the case that if you get rid of, or are able to ban tiktok, does the outrage then disappear or doesn't then go on to mark's ochberg and elon musk and others? >> you know, i do not know. i just think of the treatment that american social media companies have gotten from congress has been so distinct from what we saw today in the case of mr. chew. just think back, mehdi remember that exchange long ago, famously, or mark zuckerberg is in front of congress and one of the committee members says, well mr. zuckerberg, how do you make money? and he responds with a smirk, while senator we sell ads. now we are in this world where suddenly they're asking the kinds of questions that i had been hoping they would've asked all along about data privacy,. the ownership structure. at one point when the committee

members actually asked mr. chew. you harvest the data all of all the americans that make money off of, it why have you been returning that money in some way to america? 90, i hang out in academic circles who hang out with these sort of things. i commend of acts have been pushing that idea about social media companies for a long time. so of course, this was mostly showmanship and it was not really an exchange of information going on these hearings. but, my gosh, it was so much more sophisticated of a response and questions that i have seen any american ceo subjected to. and so that means the big difference. >> it is amazing what geopolitics and geo phobia can do for a hearing. the washington post found that 41% of americans now support a ban on, tiktok but that poll makes clear -- who doesn't want tiktok banned. age 18 to 34 years, democrats will have to go against a key

section of their base if they want to -- and then tiktok nationwide. well they don't? >> i wonder who in their staff is in the back row raising a hand saying, excuse me sir, i just want to point out that these are your new voters. these are your people who are active. you know, everybody is tiktok is different of course in my experience is anecdotal just like anybody else, but my tiktok is a wash of a progressive politics in all kinds of activism and organizing and rhetoric and all of this crazy stuff that you just think yourself, boy, this is a real fire hydrant of progressive political activism. yeah, are those the people that you want to make angry by banning their favorite social media platform? i don't really know. i think there's an assumption

really that people will not, will somehow give up tiktok and go back to instagram or go back to facebook where progressive politics has found its footing. we know that republican voters -- on tiktok, that is not the big phase there. so they don't have to worry about that, but progressive politicians, that is a really worry here and i wonder face-off that through. >> 30 seconds, left i've got to ask jake. twitter saying today they're ending the verifications of a blue check marks, april 1st, not a practical joke apparently. what does that mean? are we going to have lots of fake mehdi hassan's out there now? >> i don't know, the sort of security efforts for tom blue check mark holders, i just told the other day that i can no longer do two factories authentication because i'm not subscriber. multiple reports at this point show that twitter's revenue and earnings are down 40% year over year and it's not going away, that elon musk i hoped it would. >> he's throwing us all under the bus as a result. jake ward, thank you for your reporting, we appreciate it. coming up, parents could have new powers over their child's education and who will it help most? not the kids, republicans. why they're planning to say the kids is being met with some irony when the 11th hour continues.

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you asked for it. [ chuckling ] before they claim that this is not about banning books, and not about having the lgbt community, let's look at the impact of similar republican legislation that has already passed on the state level look at these books that have already been banned, due to republican measures. the life of rosa parks. this, apparently, is too woke by the republican party. the last thing before we go tonight, save the kids, house members came to the floor today to debate speaker kevin mccarthy's parents bill of rights proposal, legislation is

going to give parents more control over classrooms, but it's really an attempt to capitalize on the educational culture war strategy, and helped when republicans the governors mansions in florida and virginia, where's axios called it last month, the gop's saved a kid strategy, it's something that maryland democratic -- falls a bit flat. >> it's about book banning, of course two years ago, more than 1600 books were banned, in the united states of america. >> but the dangerous fanaticism, authoritarianism, and abuse of the tallies right wing religious fundamentalism movement, all about oppressing women's control over their own bodies, handmaid's tale, margaret atwood's extraordinary to dystopian novel but a

right-wing messaging is moving, that uses high technology ended craved religious ideology to control not only the minds of their followers, the private and public lives, and the fertility of women, and of course, george orwell's 1984 -- dollars trying to censor this one. it's amazing to me to see politicians who oppose a universal violent criminal background check and who defend assault weapons after the massacres at columbine, after parkland florida, after sandy hook in newtown connecticut, after uvalde, after santa fe texas, they're now going to keep america's children safe, by banning handmaid's tale, 1984. >> representative raskin to take us off the air tonight, with some rousing and important rhetoric. and on that note, i wish you

goodnight, mehdi hassan in for stephanie ruhle, from all of our colleagues across the networks thank you for staying up, late so you at the end of tomorrow. >> good evening from washington, i'm michael steele in for chris hayes. that so-called law and order republican party is once again siding with lawless insurrectionists mob. today, republican speaker of the house, kevin mccarthy, met with the mother of ashley babbitt, the january six insurrectionists who was killed by capitol police after she tried to break through a doorway leading to the house chamber. and it was clear that mccarthy didn't want to talk about it. >> mister speaker, why are you -- ashley babbitt? what do you plan to talk to her? [inaudible] >> she just asked for a meeting. is that all it takes? because i'm sure there are a